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manwithaplan wrote:Good advice Eric, I'm going to try that. Without transcoding, the quality is insanely good of course, but probably only suitable within my local LAN. But yes, having multiple players will help there. By the way, something I'm curious about...when I transcode to flv, I never can jump ahead in the video, only able to pause and release pause. When not transcoding, I can jump around in the video as normal for any video player. But not with flash, is that normal? You seeing this too?
Thanks again, will give your ideas a try here.
Brian
manwithaplan wrote:Eric,
I've tried several things, but having a real hard time with macroblocking for all my video's. It's not stuttering anymore, bandwidth doesn't seem to be the issue, but real bad macroblocking still. I poked around and found this thread that you might find interesting...
http://forum.subsonic.org/forum/viewtop ... ght=ffmpeg
I've tried to get libx264 working instead of the normal ffmpeg default flv conversion per the above thread, but I can't get it to play at all with variants of these strings. These guys were using Windows, so some things are different of course, but I made the proper changes I thought and I just get Video not found errors as before. The logs don't tell me much either. Have a look at it and see if you can get some of these suggestions working. I might have a corrupted version of ffmpeg and may have to load the bundle of yours that you made, just downloaded it actually. Let me know what you find, but I think these guys were able to smooth out the video side in a tremendous way from the sounds of it. Now we just need to figure out the Mac equivalent setup that will execute the same things.
-Brian
epstewart wrote:manwithaplan wrote:Eric,
I've tried several things, but having a real hard time with macroblocking for all my video's. It's not stuttering anymore, bandwidth doesn't seem to be the issue, but real bad macroblocking still. I poked around and found this thread that you might find interesting...
http://forum.subsonic.org/forum/viewtop ... ght=ffmpeg
I've tried to get libx264 working instead of the normal ffmpeg default flv conversion per the above thread, but I can't get it to play at all with variants of these strings. These guys were using Windows, so some things are different of course, but I made the proper changes I thought and I just get Video not found errors as before. The logs don't tell me much either. Have a look at it and see if you can get some of these suggestions working. I might have a corrupted version of ffmpeg and may have to load the bundle of yours that you made, just downloaded it actually. Let me know what you find, but I think these guys were able to smooth out the video side in a tremendous way from the sounds of it. Now we just need to figure out the Mac equivalent setup that will execute the same things.
-Brian
Brian,
OK, that's a lot to try to absorb quickly, so I will be looking further into it this weekend, time permitting.
Meanwhile, I'll just report that yesterday while I was out and about, I intended to try the same sort of experimentation I reported on before. Before, I was at home and was running both my client Mac and my server Mac, connected to my base station via Ethernet, on my home LAN. The results were as indicated. But when I took my client MacBook Pro to the public library and tried streaming movies via their wireless network, I could not even get Subsonic to access my media library. Having coincidentally just replaced my Internet modem with a "DOCSIS" model supplied by Xfinity/Comcast, I suspected that might be the problem. Today, I'm back at home and hooked up as I was before, with no problems. However, my Subsonic URL seems to resolve to 10.0.1.___ on my client, meaning that I am bypassing the Internet.
I'll have to try access from a remote location again when an occasion arises, but all this got me thinking: I don't know about yours, but my Internet provider limits upstream speeds. If you have X-number of users out there, might not that impose a problem with stuttering, choppiness, etc.? It might lead to a bottleneck which makes no difference except when enough users are trying to stream enough movies, all at once. Or do you have that possibility under control already?
manwithaplan wrote:epstewart wrote:manwithaplan wrote:Eric,
I've tried several things, but having a real hard time with macroblocking for all my video's. It's not stuttering anymore, bandwidth doesn't seem to be the issue, but real bad macroblocking still. I poked around and found this thread that you might find interesting...
http://forum.subsonic.org/forum/viewtop ... ght=ffmpeg
I've tried to get libx264 working instead of the normal ffmpeg default flv conversion per the above thread, but I can't get it to play at all with variants of these strings. These guys were using Windows, so some things are different of course, but I made the proper changes I thought and I just get Video not found errors as before. The logs don't tell me much either. Have a look at it and see if you can get some of these suggestions working. I might have a corrupted version of ffmpeg and may have to load the bundle of yours that you made, just downloaded it actually. Let me know what you find, but I think these guys were able to smooth out the video side in a tremendous way from the sounds of it. Now we just need to figure out the Mac equivalent setup that will execute the same things.
-Brian
Brian,
OK, that's a lot to try to absorb quickly, so I will be looking further into it this weekend, time permitting.
Meanwhile, I'll just report that yesterday while I was out and about, I intended to try the same sort of experimentation I reported on before. Before, I was at home and was running both my client Mac and my server Mac, connected to my base station via Ethernet, on my home LAN. The results were as indicated. But when I took my client MacBook Pro to the public library and tried streaming movies via their wireless network, I could not even get Subsonic to access my media library. Having coincidentally just replaced my Internet modem with a "DOCSIS" model supplied by Xfinity/Comcast, I suspected that might be the problem. Today, I'm back at home and hooked up as I was before, with no problems. However, my Subsonic URL seems to resolve to 10.0.1.___ on my client, meaning that I am bypassing the Internet.
I'll have to try access from a remote location again when an occasion arises, but all this got me thinking: I don't know about yours, but my Internet provider limits upstream speeds. If you have X-number of users out there, might not that impose a problem with stuttering, choppiness, etc.? It might lead to a bottleneck which makes no difference except when enough users are trying to stream enough movies, all at once. Or do you have that possibility under control already?
Great questions, and glad to see you trying remotely now, good stuff. You really need to NAT through your firewall that internal IP address. So to find out what your external IP is, just browse to http://www.whatismyip.com/ and write it down. Then make sure your router/firewall is allowing Port 4040 into the internal IP of your server. But let me know if you hit problems there as I think I can help you in this regard. I am a network engineer by trade, so LAN/WAN connectivity issues I've got a good grasp on you might say. My ISP does not limit my up/down bandwidth at all, I use Comcast Business class with static IP's and such. Even the normal Comcast residential they would not limit bandwidth per se. Especially on the odd port of 4040. Some ISP's (read many) will throttle port 80 traffic, or 443, or 25, the common well known mail and web ports. But the higher number (read strange) ports typically will not pose an issue. Though, in point of fact, if the ISP wanted to, regardless of port number, they could use several tools to limit web traffic regardless of port number. Comcast to my knowledge does not do that. Not sure what ISP you are using, but they will typically have to publish their guidelines on these things, or simply call them to find out.
A good speed/throughput measurement site, really the best one out there that I've found in terms of accuracy, is provided by none other than Vonage. I use this all the time to gauge WAN speeds. Currently I'm getting 25Mbps down/10Mbps up with the Comcast Business package I have. Check out yours by launching this from home at some point...
http://support.vonage.com/doc/en_us/497.xml
The ffmpeg transcoding settings that would use libx264 would be of great interest to me if we can somehow get them working on the Mac server. I'll keep testing from some remote locations, but I really think it's gonna take libx264 to improve significantly on the situation. Let me know what you find. Also, let me know who your ISP is, I may be able to shed more light on their usage policies.
Cheers,
Brian
manwithaplan wrote:Eric,
Your assumptions about bandwidth usage are fortunately wrong my friend! You'll be happy to know that it doesn't work that way. I won't go too far into it, but essentially bandwidth and bit rate have nothing to do with each other. Your 6,000kbps upload speed is more than capable of streaming movies to much more than 6 concurrent users. Likewise, mine much more than 10. I understand your concerns about bandwidth, but you and I are both just fine in that regard. It would be different if we had some old school DSL connection whose upload speeds are typically limited to 768Kbps and such. We should place our focus back on server/processor usage, that is much more likely to be maxed out than our bandwidth, again, in our cases at least. So far I've never had more than 2 concurrent users anyway, so again we're down a rathole there. So rest assured our problems are not bandwidth on the server's (home) WAN connection side. I'd be happy to help you t-shoot the external connectivity stuff, to make sure your NAT and port mappings are working properly. But of course I would need that third octetPM me if you want and we can t-shoot it on the phone much quicker.
But yeah, if you get time to look at the server-side libx264 issues, that would be great. I'll let you know if I have any breakthroughs over here.
Cheers,
Brian
manwithaplan wrote:We are simply thinking this because of the significant improvement in smooth playback and no macroblocking reported in the other thread I pointed you to. I'm taking their experienced word for it at this point, admittedly. But they indicated a significant improvement and "buttery smooth" playback when using libx264. That's why I was hoping we could find a way to utilize it on the Mac. My attempts have been unsuccessful with my build of ffmpeg in utilitizng libx264. I see libx264 is part of my libraries, but for some reason the commands they mention do not work for me on the Mac. Because you are much swifter at this server-side stuff than I am, was hoping you'd be interested in attempting it also, to see if you get better results. I'm more network engineering-minded and not a server app guy. Still trying to understand this stuff with Subsonic.
Let me know what you think.
Thanks,
Brian
manwithaplan wrote:Interesting. yeah, definitely want to see if there's some way that we can mimic what these Windows guys are doing in that thread. The Mac ports seems the right move, you've gotten way further than me on it. Let me know if you're able to get some libx264 working. I wonder if it's worth building a Windows virtual machine and loading subsonic and ffmpeg there to try and mimic what they did. Not sure that would really help us find the Mac equivalents though...
Brian
epstewart wrote:manwithaplan wrote:Interesting. yeah, definitely want to see if there's some way that we can mimic what these Windows guys are doing in that thread. The Mac ports seems the right move, you've gotten way further than me on it. Let me know if you're able to get some libx264 working. I wonder if it's worth building a Windows virtual machine and loading subsonic and ffmpeg there to try and mimic what they did. Not sure that would really help us find the Mac equivalents though...
Brian
Brian,
I do have the ability to run a Windows XP VM, through Parallels Desktop 5. I thought about trying Subsonic/FFmpeg/libx264 in it, but rejected the idea as unenlightening. I gather your main concern is hopefully to have libx264 decoding on the server side overcome to whatever extent possible the playback/speed/bitrate issues related to your users' use of WiFi and the Internet at remote locations. Your users do not get smooth playback, and maybe libx264 on the server can cure that.
I think the central issue is speed — speed of decoding on the server side, speed of transmission along the network, and speed of rendering on the client side.
If I set things up in Windows/Parallels, there will just be one more potential stage which can throttle down speed.
So ... it occurs to me that you might (or might not) want to let me log in as a guest on your Subsonic server and see what issues I experience. If you want me to give it a try, would you care to PM me with the relevant details?
If for any reason you'd like to try streaming things from my Subsonic server, I can set you up for that as well ...
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